The College Conversation
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Description
From an Ivy League dean and a college admissions expert, a guide to help parents support their children as they navigate their way to college
The College Conversation is a comprehensive resource for mapping the path through the college application process that provides practical advice and reassurance to keep both anxious parents and confused children sane and grounded. Rather than adding to the existing canon of “How to Get In” college guides or rankings, Eric Furda and Jacques Steinberg provide a step-by-step approach to having the tough conversations on this topic with less stress and more success.
The book is organized around key discussions and themes that trace the chronological arc of admissions and financial aid–beginning before the assembly of a list of potential colleges and continuing through the receipt of decisions–with a final section that includes advice on the first year of college. The topics include preliminary conversations about the search, and specifically how parents can think about their children’s interests and what kind of college would best suit them; choosing a college (based on its curriculum, culture, and community); writing the most effective essays; assessing acceptances, including considerations of finances and aid; and making the transition from high school to college life.
The College Conversation will provide parents, students, and counselors with the credible, level-headed information often missing in this process, as well as a much-needed dash of perspective borne of experience.Praise for The College Conversation
“A family new to the process will be glad for the book’s detailed timeline and instructions for essay writing, test taking and applying for financial aid. Recognizing the value of a range of options, the authors discuss the wisdom of starting at a community college, entering the military first, or, if freshman year isn’t working out, transferring from one college to another. Such discussions are rare in books of this kind and thus particularly welcome.”
—The Wall Street Journal
“Thorough [and] instructive. . . . Furda and Steinberg provide a high level of detail, making this volume useful to parents who haven’t been through the process before as well as to those familiar with it. A helpful guide for parents with children approaching college age.”
—Library Journal
“This exceptional guide to your family’s college conversation will help you help your teen develop their own ideas about what they want in college.”
—Grown and Flown
“Eric Furda and Jacques Steinberg are giants in the field of college admission, so it isn’t surprising that they have created one of the best books I have read on navigating the college admission process. Every parent of middle or high schoolers should read The College Conversation, which illuminates and demystifies the process, as well as provides important practical advice for forging partnerships between parents and their children.”
—Marcia Hunt, director of college and academic advising, Pine Crest School (Fort Lauderdale, FL) and former president, National Association for College Admission Counseling
“The College Conversation brings students and families together with meaningful exercises that help students reflect on their interests and potential. Steinberg and Furda understand the emotional toll of the admissions process and dial down the anxiety. They show how to research schools, navigate financial aid, and even take you behind the scenes in admissions offices after students hit the ‘submit’ button. This is essential reading for college-bound students and their families.”
—Julie Shimabukuro, 9th and 10th Grade Principal, John Burroughs School, and former director of undergraduate admissions at Washington University in St. Louis
“In The College Conversation, Eric Furda and Jacques Steinberg have shared a lifetime of deep experience and wisdom in the college admissions and higher education fields. The authors strike an impressive balance: they offer a rich array of straightforward, practical, realistic, and actionable insights and strategies. Simultaneously, they keep the authentic health, well being, and thriving of students and families at the core of each chapter. With these shared values, this is the one book that parents, educators, and student advocates need to help their students gain the most from the college admissions journey.”
—Ana Rowena McCullough, founder and CEO, QuestBridge
“Finally—a book on college fit that addresses the question of cost as a function of college fit! Eric Furda and Jacques Steinberg provide a thoughtful dissection of the incredibly complex college admissions process in a way that can resonate with school counselors, parents, and students. With a focus on introspection and reflection—from the initial college search, to the reality of college cost and its role in the application process, and in the aftermath of understanding admissions decisions—everyone will emerge from this book with a better understanding of how to advise and support students, from our most-vulnerable to our most-resourced.”
—Sara Urquidez, executive director, Academic Success Program, Dallas
“Never before has it been so crystal clear that—for the future financial security of students and families—the choice of college must be approached as a value proposition (as much, if not more, than anything else). Jacques and Eric provide a reassuring roadmap to coming to a decision that makes your child happy without breaking the bank.”
—Jean Chatzky, New York Times bestselling author and CEO, HerMoney.com
“Finding the right college can be nerve-racking for students and parents alike. But it can also serve as a growing experience for both generations and a lesson in adult decision-making for students. The authors draw on their unique experiences to help families navigate that bizarre and uniquely American rite of passage known as college admissions.”
—Edward B. Fiske, editor, Fiske Guide to CollegesEric J. Furda is the dean of admissions at the University of Pennsylvania and the former executive director of admissions at Columbia University.
Jacques Steinberg is the New York Times bestselling author of The Gatekeepers and You Are an Ironman, and is a former New York Times education journalist. He has served as a senior executive at Say Yes Education and is on the board of the National Association for College Admission Counseling. He appears periodically as a college admissions expert on NBC’s Today show.
A. The “Why College?” Conversation
These are most certainly days of disruption in higher education. At some private four-year colleges and universities, the full cost of attendance (before financial aid) can approach $80,000. That figure is not only well above the median family income in this country ($63,179, according to the U.S. Census Bureau) but it has increased at rates far higher than inflation at many points over the last few decades. At prices this high, families are wise to consider the return on such an investment, including its usefulness as preparation for entering the workforce and a career.
We believe that there is still a strong case to be made for acquiring a traditional four-year bachelor’s degree, beyond its utilitarian value, though with a few caveats. Once again, you need to know your child-and to ask them, and yourself, some fundamental questions. Do you, as a parent, feel that as the end of their senior year of high school approaches, they are emotionally ready for a four-year college experience, whether living at home or independently on campus? Even with the range of price points for four-year college tuition (whether at an in-state public institution, which is typically more reasonably priced, or at a private institution that offers deep discounts in the form of financial aid), is a bachelor’s degree something that you as a family can afford?
There is also the question of the goal and purpose of your child’s attending a four-year institution. Are they interested, for example, in the intrinsic value of learning and knowledge? Of having opportunities to build relationships and to network? And to what extent do they see college as a pathway to a career, or at least as laying the groundwork for it? Finally, does your child view college, at least in part, as preparation for a graduate school experience, including medical school, law school, or other professional degree?
In this section we hope to provide you with some supporting evidence for the importance of a four-year degree and a return on that investment. But we’ll also consider other paths-including associate’s degrees, the transfer process between community college and more traditional four-year colleges, and career credentialing. In some ways the range of such educational choices following high school is unique to the United States, where one doesn’t have to decide on a career at eighteen years old.
When we refer to “discovery” in the title of this chapter, we’re imagining conversations in which your child will discover aspects of themselves that will help guide them through this process and will serve not only to enlighten them but you as a parent, too. Before we get started, let’s define a few basic terms.
Bachelor’s Degree
A strong body of evidence exists that supports the value of studying for and completing a bachelor’s degree. In terms of lifetime earnings, the latest figures from the Bureau of Labor Statistics reveal that people who attain at least a bachelor’s degree will earn roughly $2.4 million over their lifetime-about $1 million more than someone whose education did not advance beyond a high school degree and $600,000 more than those with an associate’s degree. Meanwhile, that bachelor’s is an essential gateway to a master’s degree ($2.8 million in lifetime earnings) and a professional degree ($4.2 million).
Omar Monteagudo, the principal of the School for Advanced Studies in Miami, a partnership between the Miami Dade County Public Schools and Miami Dade College, tells students as well as parents, “The bachelor’s degree is what the high school diploma used to be ten, twenty, thirty years ago.”
Jennifer Delahunty, the former dean of admissions of Kenyon College in Ohio is the editor of a book with a title intended as a not-so-subtle rebuke from children to their parents-I’m Going to College, Not You! It includes an essay by Gail Hudson, a writer based in Seattle, who advises families to broaden the concept of the return on investment of a bachelor’s degree beyond just dollars and cents. “More income doesn’t necessarily mean more happiness,” she writes. “Education can’t buy us loving spouses and joyful lives.”
If a bachelor’s-degree-granting institution, particularly one rooted in the liberal arts, is doing its job well, then its graduates will develop critical-thinking skills and the ability to communicate clearly and persuasively. These are skills and qualities that can ultimately benefit the larger community and are essential to the functioning of a democratic society.
For young people who may be the first in their families to attend college-or those whose family income ranks among the lowest in the nation-there is also persuasive research demonstrating the value of a bachelor’s degree as a vehicle for social mobility. For example, children from low-income families who graduate from the nation’s most selective colleges have nearly the same odds of reaching the top fifth of the nation’s income distribution as their peers from higher-income families, according to a study by the Equality of Opportunity Project.
“A college education acts as a leveler, dramatically reducing the correlation between parents’ income and the adult incomes of their children,” the researchers Richard V. Reeves and Eleanor Krause wrote in a Brookings Institution blog post in January 2018. “This is true for elite colleges, other four-year institutions, and community colleges.”
Enrolling in a bachelor’s-degree-granting institution should not be assumed to be a guarantee of completion. Studies have shown that as many as 40 percent of young people who enroll in a four-year college or university don’t go on to graduate from that institution. While some will transfer to other schools and complete their degrees there, many others will drop out as a result of not being properly prepared for college work and the college experience, or being swamped in debt, to say nothing of being distracted by hours spent working a part-time job to defray the cost of that education.
Associate’s Degree
There are many reasons-and arguably more today than ever before-why your child might want to at least consider beginning their education after high school at a community college. Parents and young people alike would do well to bear in mind what Alfred Herrera, an assistant vice provost at UCLA, told us: “Community college is college.”
A big argument for community college is economic. While many families hesitate to commit to the cost of a traditional four-year college degree, an associate’s program can be a much more economical option. For example, a year spent as a full-time student in an associate’s program at a community college will have an annual average cost of less than $4,000. That compares to roughly $40,000, on average, for tuition for a year of full-time study at a four-year private college or university.
In an ideal world some, if not all, community college credits would be transferable to a four-year institution-enabling your child to save no small amount on the first year or two of tuition while still graduating with a bachelor’s degree. The State University System of Florida and the California State University system are among many across the country that have so-called articulation agreements that formalize the transfer of associate’s credits to bachelor’s programs. A student who successfully completes an associate’s degree at one of 115 California community colleges is guaranteed priority admission to at least one college in its state university system, though not necessarily to the campus of their choice. (The program even has the catchy name “Degree with a Guarantee.”) As another example, the State University of New York at New Paltz has agreements governing transfer credits with more than three hundred community colleges.
“We’re not suggesting students stop at an associate’s degree,” Dr. Herrera, who also leads the Academic Advancement Program at UCLA, explained. “The whole idea is to get job training or to go the transfer route.”
We want to emphasize, however, that despite the many opportunities available to transfer associate’s degree credits to bachelor’s degree programs, many four-year colleges do not accept such credits, or may have strict rules for doing so. Your child should be sure to check with the relevant institutions early in the process about how such credits will be handled.
Another reason your child might consider starting their postsecondary education at a community college is more emotional in nature, and perhaps related to maturity as well as burnout. Your child might also feel that they are not quite ready to make the commitment, emotional or otherwise, to enrolling at a four-year school, which could include living independently. Although parents might be inclined to advise their children to power through to a four-year setting straight from high school, community college can offer something of a modest respite close to home. Attending a local community college might also enable your child to better tend to important domestic responsibilities, such as caring for an ill family member or working to help support the household-obligations that might not leave a student much of a choice in the school they attend. Of course, as an alternative, many nearby four-year colleges and universities that would enable students to live at home could also help satisfy all these objectives.
If your child is considering beginning their education at a community college, establish a purposeful plan for doing so. According to the National Student Clearinghouse Research Center, only 13 percent of community college students went on to earn a bachelor’s degree within six years. For at least some of those who did not, an associate’s degree may, in fact, be the most appropriate way to complete a formal postsecondary education. A bachelor’s is not for everyone, and depending on your child’s career goals, it may not even be necessary.
There may also be opportunities for your child to take community college courses for credit while still in high school. These dual enrollment programs have sprouted up at high schools and community colleges around the nation to offer high school students access to a more rigorous curriculum. Courses in dual enrollment programs can serve as a supplement to those offered within a traditional high school setting, including through the College Board’s Advanced Placement program. By enrolling in these courses, students demonstrate their initiative and intellectual inquisitiveness, as well as their desire to seek out a challenge.
Aligning Military Service with a College Degree
Parents whose children are interested in military service should be aware that it does not foreclose the pursuit of a college degree. In the wake of the conflicts in Afghanistan and Iraq, many colleges and universities have established admissions initiatives specifically aimed at veterans. Under the Post-9/11 GI Bill and its associated Yellow Ribbon Program, veterans who served on or after September 11, 2001, are eligible for financial support from the federal government to defray the cost of at least a portion of their higher-education expenses. More information can be found in the benefits section on the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs website.
Students who wish to serve in the military while attending college have the option of joining the Reserve Officers’ Training Corps (ROTC), which is currently available at more than 1,700 colleges and universities across the nation in partnership with all branches of the military. Students enrolled in ROTC have the cost of their college tuition partially (and in some cases fully) funded by the military and the opportunity to earn the rank of officer, in exchange for a commitment to serve in an active-duty capacity for at least three years upon graduation.
At the University of Pennsylvania, where there is a Navy ROTC program, Eric works directly with a navy liaison who identifies candidates in the university’s admissions pool who have been awarded NROTC scholarships. He personally reviews every application from an NROTC candidate, which students submit through a separate process that runs parallel to the traditional admissions system.
Another option is one of the nation’s five service academies, which were established “for the undergraduate education and training of commissioned officers for the United States Armed Forces.” In the order of their founding, they are: the U.S. Military Academy in West Point, New York; the Naval Academy in Annapolis, Maryland; the Coast Guard Academy in New London, Connecticut; the Merchant Marine Academy in Kings Point, New York; and the Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs, Colorado. In addition to having the cost of their tuition and room and board covered by the U.S. government, and earning the rank of officer, graduates of the five service academies are also awarded bachelor of science degrees. As is the case with recipients of ROTC scholarships, graduates of the service academies commit to active-duty service. Candidates for admission must apply directly to each academy and secure a nomination typically from a member of Congress (or a delegate, in the case of residents of the District of Columbia and Puerto Rico). Applicants must also pass a rigorous physical exam.
Alternate Paths to a College Degree or Other Postsecondary Credential
One of the relatively new forms of education is massive open online courses (MOOCs). These may be available for free, but there is typically a nominal charge for those who wish to earn a certificate of completion. In some instances it is possible to earn an associate’s, bachelor’s, or even master’s degree entirely online, at a fraction of the cost of an on-campus, brick-and-mortar experience. And as with dual enrollment programs, an increasing number of high school students are supplementing their education-including in areas like calculus, advanced writing, and computer coding-by accessing these curricula online. Coursera offers more than 3,600 courses and is affiliated with nearly two hundred colleges and universities. Companies like Amazon and Cisco also offer Coursera courses, for employees as well as the general public.
For a variety of reasons, none of the credentials discussed in this section may be of interest to-or appropriate for-many learners, including those who may wish to go directly from high school into a trade. Parents seeking information about industry-approved credentials available on that pathway might begin by logging on to the website of an institution like Lincoln Tech. Its CEO, Scott M. Shaw, describes the mission of the institution, which was founded in 1946, as “training students for in-demand careers in some of America’s most important industries,” ranging from diesel technology to medical billing, and from culinary arts to welding.
Some parents will remain unpersuaded about the value of a college education altogether and will wish to steer their children clear of one-at least initially. Currently only a little more than a third of American adults have a bachelor’s degree or higher. A movement called UnCollege promoting alternatives to higher education was founded by Dale J. Stephens. Homeschooled as a child, Stephens dropped out of Hendrix College in Arkansas to accept a $100,000 fellowship from Peter Thiel, the cofounder of PayPal. Stephens used his fellowship to create UnCollege, which provides “resources for self-directed learning, dropping out of college, and hacking your education,” with a vision of “a world where people take ownership of their education.” Stephens prizes the acquisition of skills and the value of real-world experiences. Visitors to the UnCollege website can also find downloadable guides on subjects like “Should I Drop Out of College?” and “Ten Crucial Skills They Won’t Teach You in School.”
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